[00:00:00] Chris Angel Murphy: Hey, welcome to a special video episode of the podcast Allyship is a Verb. I'm the host, Chris Angel, and my pronouns are they/them.

About once a quarter, I host a free online event. On December 4th, 2022, I hosted “Are You Okay? Empowering Trans Youth through Storytelling.” I recommend watching this on Spotify or YouTube to see the portraits as you hear the stories; it won't be the same if you only listen. All links will be provided in the episode notes.

Let me tell you about my friends and why we organized this event. Author and photographer Jesse Freiden, he/him pronouns, is behind “Are You Okay?” It docents the experiences and stories of over 120 and counting trans and non-binary youth living in the United States during this time of horrific anti-trans legislation. Flanked by their supportive families, these outspoken and deeply loved youth present their strength to the world in a revolt against the country's attempt to erase them. Youth can sign up to be a part of the series still.

This event features audio clips of the interviews with the youth and their families, portraits of the youth and more.

I also brought in my friend Rebecca Minor, she/her pronouns, a gender specialist and parent coach, among many other hats. Together, they discussed the resilience of trans youth and the importance of allowing trans youth to tell their own stories. As a gender specialist, Rebecca partners with trans and gender nonconforming youth throughout their journey of becoming and guides their parents in affirming it.

I'm happy to report that we had 365 RSVPs and $300 in donations to help keep Jesse's series “Are You Okay?” going. The donations help to cover gas, food, lodging, and other related costs for traveling across the States, capturing stories and portraits. Links to the project, where to donate, and where trans, non-binary, and gender non-conforming youth can sign up are all on his website linked below. If the stories move you, there's even more featured on his website.

You may have noticed I am now rocking Allyship as a Verb merch. This is one of the designs, it's a gradient design and the other one has an infinity symbol on it. And what's gonna happen is the proceeds from the shirts, the sweatshirts, like this one, the hoodies - that's all gonna go toward helping me produce Allyship as a Verb. This season alone is gonna be costing me over $3,000 USD, and it's a lot. This is an expensive project that I put together and I'm very proud of my work and I want to continue to have more stories to share and I want to be able to confidently say that there's gonna be a season three, but I really need the help; and that means helping me to fundraise by buying the merch.

There's also gonna be limited edition stickers. As you can see, this is holographic, it's about three inches wide. But yes, I did a limited batch of these, so if you want these, I expect that they're gonna go kind of quickly. Again, all of this is to help me to produce this podcast. And if you end up buying anything, I would love to see where you put the stickers or see you rocking the clothing. Thank you so much for considering all of those details are gonna be down below.

And now here's the event.

[00:04:01] Jesse Freidin: Awesome. I'm Jesse. I'm really excited to be here doing this event. I identify as a queer man of trans experience. I am a photographer. For the past two years - actually, maybe it's almost been three years now - I have been traveling the country photographing trans and non-binary youth alongside their supportive families for my current series entitled, “Are You Okay?”

I've docented over 120 youth so far, in more than half the states in the country. My goal is to show a portrait of trans youth that we aren't seeing right now: one where they're unconditionally supported, sitting in their power, speaking honestly, and more importantly, showing their joy and resilience and strength amidst this moment of truly extreme backlash.

So, we'll talk a bit more about the project as we go - but Rebecca, I'll turn it over to you.

[00:05:00] Rebecca Minor: Thanks Jesse. So my name is Rebecca Minor, I use she/her pronouns, I identify as a neuroqueer femme. I am a gender specialist, which means I partner with queer and trans youth in their journey of becoming, and I'm a guide to their parents in affirming it.

What that looks like in practice is: I'm a therapist, I do parent coaching, and I also teach and provide education around these subjects. So I'm thrilled to be here to have this conversation with Jessie and am like - well, I was gonna say I'm the nber one fan, I don't know if I'm the nber one fan - I feel like the nber one fan of this project. So I'm honored to get to be a part of this conversation and to share some of these incredible images and stories with you all.

[00:05:42] Jesse Freidin: Thanks, Rebecca. Here's, the website. If you go to the website, there is a lot of images and stories. There's a page of resources that we'll talk a little bit about later. You can donate if you are so inclined. This project has been 100% funded by generous donations - complete strangers, some patrons of mine over the years, families that I've worked with. Right now I am working on developing a book and exhibit, but it will continue traveling.

I always like to start with this portrait of Cam.

[begin pre-recorded interview audio of Cam, Cam’s mom, and Jesse]

Cam: I feel unprotected and unsafe. Pushing, bullying, not getting stuff that your family needs. Like if I moved to Texas or Florida -

Jesse [in interview]: What would happen?

Cam: Kablooey!

Jesse [in interview]: Kablooey.

Cam: I would pretty much move to France or maybe back to Minnesota.

Cam’s mom: When the Attorney General in Texas put forth their statement about investigating families, although we're much safer in Minnesota, it made me look at our circle of - like if something like that was passed here, who would turn us in? You know?

Cam: Mom, if someone passed those laws?

Cam’s mom: yes.

Cam: Would we move?

Cam’s mom: I would go anywhere on earth to keep you safe.

Cam: Like Antarctica?

Cam’s mom: If I had to go Antarctica, we would go there and put a trans flag up. So they tried to give him an alternative bathroom to use and you came home from school and you said, “why do I have to use the girl’s bathroom?” And you said, “Is it because I'm gross?”

Cam: Mm-hmm. .

[00:07:14] Cam’s mom: And then mom got really mad. I worked for the district where Cam goes, and I wasn't tenured yet. But once I got tenured last April, then we met with the superintendent and the director of student support services and I showed them your picture and I said, “This is the boy that's in your class. We just want the record to match the child.” Do you wanna know something I've never told you?

Cam: What?

Cam’s mom: Mrs. [inaudible], the principal knew you were using the boy’s bathroom and she thought that was totally fine and okay.

What do you want people to know about being a trans kid in Minnesota?

Cam: That you are protected and safe! Be who you are. That’s the message!

Jesse: That's [laughs], that's perfect.

[end pre-recorded interview with Cam]

So I love starting this presentation with Cam's portrait. Like a lot of the parents that I've photographed, or families I've photographed, I've become close with Cam's parents. I keep in touch with these parents, they keep me updated on how all their wonderful kids are.

This project is here to show the complete normalcy of what it is to be a trans and non-binary young person. I was photographing people under 24 and - to show how truly secure these kids are in themselves and how they know themselves so well.

But one theme that comes up in this interview, like a lot of interviews, is the fear of having to leave your state. I just spoke with Cam's mom recently, and there are some good democratic protections happening in, in their state. But in a lot of states where I've photographed, that's not the case.

So, yeah, I was just wondering, Rebecca, if that's the theme that's been coming up for you in the work you're doing, even in, you know, a safer state: the fear of how do we help our, our trans and non-binary kids deal with the fear of leaving their state, leaving their country, et cetera?

[00:09:18] Rebecca Minor: Sure. I mean, first of all, I don't want any children to have to think about this, right? The fact that an eight year old is thinking about having to leave the country, is just beyond unacceptable to me. Like you said, I do- so I practice in Massachusetts, which is a very safe state, as far as these things are concerned. These subjects absolutely still come up in session often because of friends who live in other states or family they have in other places, or just the general sense of like, “What if I lived in a state like that? I would have to think about these things.”

When I do parent coaching - I'm able to do that anywhere in the US - so I do work with families who are in states where they're having to make some of these decisions. And I mean, it's huge, right? It's not - because then it's about changing everything for the entire family. Parents are considering risking jobs and career opportunities just to be able to get their kids to a place where they can be safe and have access to healthcare.

These questions are looming every day.

[00:10:20] Jesse Freidin: I've gone back and forth, like I think a lot of, people in the community, keeping up to date, you know, having my finger on the pulse of what is happening in our world, what attacks are happening, what legislation's happening, to hurt the community. I was just, you know, reading right before this about another attack on, you know, like Drag Show or something like that.

Rebecca Minor: Yes.

Jesse Freidin: In states where we think things are safe. I really wanna balance with this project and in this conversation today, that there is a lot of fear for these kids. Whether they're Cam's age Cam's eight, or some of these older, younger [both laugh], older youths in college, or adults. You know, I think everyone has fear. But what we need to do is speak out and tell our stories, if we are comfortable doing that, and show the humanity of the community that's being harmed - and that's the point of this project.

So I'm gonna go back to the images. So, this is Sammy, who I photographed in Illinois. I've worked really hard, to tell a story that's not being told. That's always my goal as, as a photographer, as a storyteller. The image of trans youth that I see - I don't know if you see this, Rebecca - whether it's, you know, a poorly done article in New York Times or some other terrible magazine, it's always sort of this sad, white, privileged, trans kid.

Rebecca Minor: Yes.

Jesse Freidin: We don't need to be showing trans kids being sad and we don't need to only show privileged, white children that are having access to social and medical transition. The way that I find these families is, well, it's an incredible amount of work, but to do outreach. I do outreach to queer centers in these states, to family groups, to PFLAG groups like the Mama Bears and Free Mom Hugs, by just doing immense amount of outreach. And then families start emailing me and saying, “I wanna get involved.”

And Sammy's mom emailed me and was like, “We are gonna be there no matter what.” They're both very busy professional parents, but she was like, “I want to show that African American families can support their trans children.” So what was –

Rebecca Minor: So important.

Jesse Freidin: Right? Yeah. Is that something that you're - how do you, I guess, talk to your families about the layers of marginalization that can happen and how to deal with that?

[00:12:51] Rebecca Minor: So I think understanding, kind of, the minority stress model and recognizing that there's these multiple layers that get tacked on here when we're not just talking about “the picture” that is so often presented of the like, white, privileged family. I find that families are - who are not white - are really feeling isolated in their communities. I see a lot of work to be done there. I see, not only does it need to happen within families and these communication patterns, like, can change around acceptance, but it also has to happen on a community and then, obviously, a much wider scale.

I'm so glad when you and I first spoke and you were like, “I'm really trying to find families of color to photograph, not because I want to tokenize anyone in any way, but because these images have to be shown for people to have any kind of sense or association with what transness can look like.”

I'm thrilled you got this portrait of Sammy and what a powerful image. Just I, yeah, I love this image.

[00:13:59] Jesse Freidin: Thanks. This family also spoke about how it was hard for them to conceive. You know, it took a long time for them to be able to have a child and this is their only child. And they spoke so clearly about a theme that I hear in, in all the interviews that I have done - every portrait is paired with the interview, you can read lots more of them on the website - but, that when you become a parent, you sort of make a contract with your child that you will love them unconditionally and support them and be there for them.

And that message is shown through every single interview that I've done in more than half the states. And for me, I think that that message is my activism, part of my activism, showing that if you - the only way to have a trans child is to support them if you want them to, to live.

This is Reese in Pennsylvania. She was adorable. You know, I always wonder like, what conversations did the families have about what they're gonna wear? I tell them to show up as their best selves, wear whatever they want, really. This is just such a sweet family. This was behind a affirming church in Pennsylvania. This family was involved with PFLAG, they were really involved with the PFLAG out there.

But what I love about Reese is that she, again, this just knows who she is. You can feel her presence here, she's so calm. There is nothing - this child is not confused about who they are. And this project came about as a direct response to my own anger and fear about what's happening in the country. The direct violence that's being, put upon the trans community right now, and to remove stigmatization and show a new kind of portrait about this experience. That's just why I like this portrait.

Let's go to Steve's audio.

[begin pre-recorded interview audio of Steve, Steve’s mom, and Jesse]

Steve: It's like they're choking the community; trying to squeeze out people who are enby, trans, gender fluid, anything like. When I first heard about it, it definitely affected my mental state a bit, but I've stood my ground and stayed as strong as I can.

I have a supportive family, a supportive group of friends online. I'm proud of myself. I'm not gonna be shot down by others' opinions. My voice is louder than theirs.

Jesse: Mm-hmm.

Steve’s mom: So this is totally them. They've always been this confident person and we wanna continue encouraging that because they are amazing. I think there's a lot of anxiety for the safety because we care and we only want the best for the children. No matter what they identify or who they feel they are, you are the difference maker in their lives. You are their first safe place and sometimes you're their only safe place. So I hope you continue to give them the love and support that they need because when they flourish, it makes everyone's lives better.

Steve: I know Steve didn't get to share with you this, but they start their hormone journey in August. We'll meet with a therapist and then in September we evaluate. So they're very excited for that. It feels empowering, getting to express my opinion freely and at least this country, we're allowed to do that. Some people are gonna try to suppress it and that's not okay. Don't give up. You got this. You don't - don't let others bring you down.

Steve’s mom: if you're struggling to find your community, you just haven't met Steve yet. [everyone laughs]

[end pre-recorded interview audio]

Jesse Freidin: What stands out for you, Rebecca, in that, in that portrait story?

[00:17:50] Rebecca Minor: I'm just blown away. I, and - I love , I love Steve's energy. This, to me, stands out as like exactly why I want people to hear these messages, because this is the confidence and the energy and the self-assuredness that I have the privilege of seeing in so many of my clients in individual sessions.

But the story that gets told publicly about trans youth is this like, quiet, sad one. And so I love hearing Steve be like, this is me. And like the idea that if you, you know, “If you're looking for community, you haven't met Steve yet.” Like, Steve clearly has enough love to go around. And to see the, of course, family support just like right behind that is the story that's like that I want people to hear.

And these are the stories that I feel like, if you knew Steve, if you knew the kids we've seen already today, you would, you would be more outraged, and people would be more active, and it wouldn't just be the two of us messaging each other on Instagram being like, what are we gonna do? Like, more people would be paying attention to some of these things. And so I want people to care about kids like Steve.

Jesse Freidin: Yeah,

Rebecca Minor: And it's just a beautiful way to get to witness their stories.

[00:19:09] Jesse Freidin: That's exactly what I'm, I'm intending to do as well. You know, it was World Aids Day on the first, and my last book came out in 2021, it's called “When Dogs Heal.” It's about people living with HIV and AIDS that have dogs and there was a very – many year project, but my intention was similar. You know, I always say I'm not smart enough to be a lawyer, so I can't, I can't do that, but I can tell a compelling story. And that's my tool, that's my activism.

And, and again, with “When Dogs Heal” about HIV, it was the exact same goal of showing the humanity, showing the incredibly beautiful, wonderful people that are thriving and surviving through this suffering, through this stigma. In that book, you can see these beautiful portraits of love and caring between person with HIV and their dog that can completely change your understanding of this diagnosis, this community, this misunderstood, marginalized, under attack, community.

And that's kinda what I was hearing you say, Rebecca, about this: if only the people that are writing these terribly, and inappropriate, uneducated smear campaign articles in the New York Times, that if only these terribly fascist politicians that are making these anti-trans laws actually met these people –

I mean this family, Steve, one of my favorite families - I try not to have favorites, but I'm human. They - so this was in Louisville. They lived hours away. They lived, you know, in a very rural farming community. They lived on a property, farming property, that was passed down from generations and generations and generations. And they just somehow found the project and wanted to tell their story. I love seeing the dad's beard. You can kind of see his long beard. He had like two [gestures beard], you know, in his mouth. They were just the most wonderful family.

And this is a very, very American family. They were this part of, you know, multi-generational forming community. They had to cut off lots of their family members, because they didn't support Steve. And they, like other families in the south that I photographed, spoke about, “We are an American family. America is about freedom, but where is our freedom?”

I ask, all the kids the exact same questions, so it's sort of like a social study, but the last question is, “what is your message to the next trans person in line?” And they always have the same message, which is like, “You're gonna be okay. You know, you're gonna get through it.” And I think that's just so beautiful.

So, okay, I'm gonna go back to the images. This is Jules who I photographed in Miami. When I was planning my trip over there, in August, I really, really wanted to go to Florida because things were so, so - things are so bad in Florida, in Texas, and everywhere. But I, I really wanted to go to the states where things were the worst.

I had this wonderful session in Florida, in Miami. Jules was from Brazil - and somehow her mom was in town for the session - and she fled Brazil because of being persecuted for, for being a trans person and she went to Miami. The interview which was half an English and half in Portuguese, was a very much about: where is safe? Again, this sort of sense of safety and, you know, the - Jules's mom was speaking about being scared for her daughter, but at the same time, you know, having such pride in, in her daughter's resilience.

So, how do you, Rebecca, kind of keep families in that space of positivity and support when again, we don't know where is safe.

[00:23:03] Rebecca Minor: I find myself so often saying, you know, both of these things can be true, right? Like, you can be terrified and you can like love and support your kid like no other. There are gonna be days or hours or times when you wake up at two in the morning worried about what something is going to mean for your kid.

You can stay grounded in the reality that they know who they are. They've shared that with you. You are honoring that. They're building a community. And hopefully the more work we all do around this and the more conversations we have and the more exposure people have to these kinds of stories, the more we'll see this start to shift and that more places can be safe places, right? And that it doesn't have to be just these tiny little enclaves, but that parents won't have to worry about their children moving through the world.

[00:23:55] Jesse Freidin: Yeah, I think that's a good point about, you know, how do we create more safe spaces. When I think about the immense work that goes into this project, coordinating, planning, editing, all, everything - and, and really holding space for these families - I could never be a therapist because my capacity for holding space is quite limited. It's -

Rebecca Minor: I don't believe that, but, okay. [both laugh]

Jesse Freidin: Well, I - when I'm on the road doing this project, you know, my friends always make fun of me, I love a road trip, but I've been on the road for like three years straight: it's a lot. I'm a little tired now. But, you know, I pack my truck and I'm like - this last trip I was on the road for a month, it was a really long trip. And I, I don't take breaks. I photograph and then I drive and I photograph and I drive and I don't see friends or talk to anyone. I'm just sort of like in this, in the zone where I have to be, to be really hyperfocused in this creative mode.

But, when I am on the road doing this project, the second I show up to my session, you know - this was outside a really great little queer center - I have endless energy and focus and attention for these families; because I'm so excited to meet them, they're happy to meet me. They wouldn't be showing up if, if they didn't want to. So it's so thrilling to be able to be on the ground meeting these people and telling these stories because I know I, I am confident even though - am I scared of what's happening in the world? Yes. Am I exhausted? Yes. All those things. But I am confident that this is already having a positive impact and will continue having a positive impact.

My goal is to make this project as accessible as possible. I'm planning on doing a, a touring exhibit for next year or 2024, a book, all these things so that this can create political positive change.

You know, the question, the big question is: how do we make more safe spaces? And I think for me, the answer is action. You know, I think about, again, spending eight years working on “When Dogs Heal” about the HIV and AIDs. I think about the AIDS epidemic and how there was no social media, obviously, then. There - you know, people were doing die-ins, people had started the AIDS quilt, Act Up started; There was no subtlety about it. There was no, well, “We can kind of rest on our laurels,” “We can just click “like” on social media, and that's our activism.”

In the nineties, you had to be pounding the pavement. You had to be doing drastic action. And I think that, along with the creative projects that were done around the AIDS epidemic, that's how things shifted. And that's what we need right now. And so, I hope people can find a way to, to get involved.

How do you tell, how do you encourage everyone to get involved?

[00:26:55] Rebecca Minor: Well, people kept asking me, so I, I decided to make a page on my website about it [laughs]; so it's easy to find. It's genderspecialist.com/protecttransyouth. I try to keep it updated with when there are, you know, opportunities to sign petitions or make calls or like whatever information people need to make it as easy as possible so that people can just go down the list and be like - boom, boom, boom, “I don't even have to think about it.” And then there are fewer excuses in my mind, for not taking that time, right?

Like, if you have five minutes, there's something that you can do. And I totally agree with you that, action I think, in many ways is the - is how I cope with the sense of helplessness that I feel at times around some of this. So I just try to figure out how to do as much as I can and I think we all have to share that labor and it shouldn't - I mean, you, you are doing this work as a labor of love and as someone who is a part of the community. And I also feel strongly that cisgender folks - this is an opportunity, like there is not time to be quiet.

And in the same way that people were pounding pavement in the nineties, like, we need to see that kind of energy again, whether it's in person or online, but it needs to - like, I can't be the only one having awkward conversations at dinner parties and going up to managers at cafes that have single user - you know, bathrooms that are still gendered, and like just constantly questioning and advocating. This has to be a shared effort.

And I believe it's possible, right? I do this work because I believe in generational change. But it's gonna take all hands on deck.

[00:28:47] Jesse Freidin: Yeah, I think that's such a great point. I, you know, I also, again, I get tired, I get sad, I - you know, it, it's a lot to hold. But when I'm taking action, I feel invincible. I feel like I have a solution; it's one tiny, fraction, speck of a solution, but it is part of the solution. I can be doing this while the wonderful people at the ACLU and Lambda Legal can be doing that, while the wonderful parents can be going to their school board meetings, you know, and standing up for their kids, we all have to play a role and -

Rebecca Minor: Absolutely, yes.

Jesse Freidin: And Jenna [re: Jenna’s YouTube comment “Visibility is key to building momentum”], thank you. Visibility is incredibly important. Again, I come from, you know, a family of, of traumatized Jews. I think about what - how, how was photography used in World War II to show the horrific destruction that was happening; people were photographing it. I feel like I'm continuing that legacy in a way. And it's, it's exhausting and upsetting, but people need to see this community that's being harmed and see who they are.

A lot of families that I've had signed up, you know, over the past couple years, I was gonna meet them in Texas and they left the country. I, you know, was gonna photograph them, but then something terrible happened at school and the kid understandably decided to not be public. I've had more than one kid signed up to do a session that took their life before I got there.

So, you know, this is happening now. And these are, you know, what I hope to be beautiful, inspiring, quiet, but powerful portraits. But, you know, this was months ago. I don't know what's happening in this kid's life right now.

So anyways - but talking about action and, and activism: this is Ash, who I was really excited to photograph in Wyoming. I was there in April, it was so cold, and so beautiful. And I went to Laramie. I, I really wanted to go to Laramie because of the dark history of Laramie. I had only two kids show up, Ash and Ash's friend Mike. They carpooled, their families are friends.

And I found, you know, I, I'm always trying to find, either I'll try to hook up with a queer center that will let me photograph in their parking lot or, you know, I was always photographing outside because of - I wanted the natural light, I wanted to be Covid-safe. In towns like Laramie, there no one was really picking up the phone necessarily for me. So what I would do is - this is why this project is so hard - I will obsessively look on Google Earth in a town for like a park that has trees or, it's a whole thing - and what I found, on Google Earth, was this like 1920s outside auditorium that was beautiful, and white; it looked like it was a studio. So that's where we met.

Ash is very beautifully, well spoken, very public, non-binary kid in high school. I mean, they're in high school and they're so smart. But they were speaking about living in small town Wyoming, and craving as a kid examples of non-binary people, that lived in these rural states. I think a lot of projects like this, or other visuals of trans people, are, you know, kids in the big cities. But I want people to know that trans and non-binary young people are everywhere in the country.

[00:32:39] Rebecca Minor: And I love seeing the confidence in Ash's face here too. Much like Reese's photo, I feel this kind of quiet, like very calm, just like, “This is me.” That's something that comes up so often, just this idea that young people don't know who they are. And that people are constantly questioning like, “Oh, well they're too young to know.” Like someone like Cam, who's only eight, that kid knows right? [laughs]

And so often my experience working with young people is that they know themselves far better than many of the adults I've ever worked with. And I just love to see that in these images, because again, like you and I talked about, I, I have this opportunity in these small moments in sessions with these kids to get to know them, but I'm bound by HIPAA, so I can't, you know, really be sharing their stories. People don't know what my clients look like. And so getting to hear the audio and see the visuals of them, it really lets people feel like they get to know them. I'm so glad that these families are showing up, because even when you have that tiny community, it's, it's community.

[00:33:45] Jesse Freidin: Yeah. I, I think you're right. What goes into this one moment is hours and hours of communication, whether it's the kid or the parent, emails me. This - Ash was the only person who addressed me as “Mr. Freiden” when they emailed me. they're very, very mature.

Rebecca Minor: Mm-hmm.

Jesse Freidin: They're very kind. But when the kid or a parent emails me, you know, they get two or three emails with a lot of information that's repeated. So the parents can check in with the kids, if they're under 18, and the over 18 kids can really think very, very clearly about the pros and cons of doing such a public project. Like you said, it's one thing to be behind closed doors in a private therapy session, or the provider. It's another thing to be completely public with your face, your name - some kids use aliases - but still it's very, very public.

They showed up because they wanted to be part of the solution. They wanted to create change by sharing their account and testimony, and there's so much pride in their presence. And because of that, this is a very repetitive setup, visually, on purpose. Because I wanted it to be like a social study to see, for me, the little tiny differences in the similar setup are just like, blows my mind. When they come to our little studio area, I introduce myself, I tell them, again, a little bit about my own story so they know that I am part of the community.

I can't tell you how many times I've had parents’ eyes, like open so wide, like they, they didn't know that I was part of the community. They, they've never met an adult, an adult trans person.

Rebecca Minor: Yeah.

Jesse Freidin: And I think that's, for me, you know, this is a two-way street: I'm feeling inspired by them, hopefully they're feeling inspired by me. And when we finally - they've got all the information, they get like an extra, “Are you sure you want to do this?” I have them sit down, I give them a very small amount of direction, but the way that I pose them is by really using my own body and my own energy and, and my own sort of lowering my voice so that they can mirror that back to me. For me, that's how to make an intimate portrait.

And we always do a short meditation; we do like five deep breaths together. And at the end, that's how this image comes up. So there's so much behind the actual -

Rebecca Minor: Wow.

Jesse Freidin: Moment. And I think it comes through, hopefully, so.

[00:36:21] Rebecca Minor: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And I mean, I, I have spent a lot of time looking at these images and it's so lovely to see them and hear you tell the stories about them. Because I feel when I see them, I already start to build my own narratives around these different families, too. Dad's forearm to me in this stands out as like, that might be a forearm that I would be afraid of, or would not be affirming, if I was walking down the street in Laramie - which I have done actually.

Jesse Freidin: It's great city.

Rebecca Minor: It's lovely - I, you know, might not think that looks like someone who is gonna be a safe person to be around. And yet, you get to see that here one mustn’t assume. Yeah.

[00:37:07] Jesse Freidin: Yeah. I, I love hearing that from, from your perspective too. Yeah. This - his name is Big Mike because there was Little Mike, the other wonderful, sweet, beautiful little trans boy, and they were all friends. And yeah, when he came up, you know, he's kind of a gruff guy, but he's so sweet and he loves his kids so much.

Rebecca Minor: Yeah.

Jesse Freidin: Yeah. You can assume. And that for me has also been a really eye-opening experience. Obviously there's 120 portraits, all different kinds of families - that we, I'm not showing in this short presentation - but I am intentionally really trying to show a, a vast, life experience of these families. To show the universal unconditional love that is the secret to having a living, adult trans child.

[begin pre-recorded interview audio of Rahliek, Rahliek’s mom, and Jesse]

Rahliek: People meet me, they don't see me as a trans guy, so I don't tell 'em I'm trans unless it's like, on a need to know basis. Like you don't need to know that. Should you ask me who I am, I'm a man, I'm a black man. That's all I need to know. When it comes to stuff like this, people should just mind their business. We not bothering nobody doing what - you know, we living life we wanna live, doing what we wanna do.

[00:38:20] Rahliek’s mom: I also feel a greater responsibility. So, for us to be able to advocate on behalf of the community that Raleigh represents racially, and through his experience living as a transgender man, there's definitely an element of protectiveness that comes out that I don't think we felt before.

[00:38:40] Rahliek: I really don't think they have a problem with us. I feel like their problem is: we aren't scared to do what they feel, like, may be wrong or what they was scared to do at one point. We don't care. We just want to be happy, and I feel like that's what intimidates them the most. Be you, because whether you died today or 20 years from now, whenever you go, you want to know that you was happy when you was here.

These same people who making these laws or feel this way, they're scared, like they fear us. And that's what people don't realize. They have money, so they feel like they have power, but we have the most power because we love ourselves. When you have you, you have everything.

[end pre-recorded interview audio]

Jesse Freidin: I, I've heard these stories a million times backwards and forward, but they still make me emotional. What was standing out to you, Rebecca, in that one?

[00:39:39] Rebecca Minor: I mean, I'm, I'm trying not to cry. I'm just blown away by the, like, the awareness and what really boils down to that reality of like, I love myself and that scares people.

[00:39:57] Jesse Freidin: I think that's just such a, a good [laughs] a good, interpretation from a therapist of what was being said [both laugh]. I love myself and that scares people. I, I don't think I - I mean, I've heard Rahliek’s story so many times, I loved him so much - I'll tell you about his story in a second – but, I love myself on that scarcity pole. To me, I relate to that so deeply. That was my experience as a child.

Rebecca Minor: Mm-hmm.

Jesse Freidin: I knew who I was from age zero, and I was like, “Get the heck outta my way because I deserve to live.” It's a miracle that I'm age 41. I can't explain how that happened. I want to give back to my community and help others. But that was my experience too. It's a sick world we live in when people, whether people of color or trans people, disabled people, any marginalized group, Jews, what any, anything: we are taught to hate ourselves because we are not, the quote unquote “norm”, which is white, cisgendered, straight men. That's it. Able, able-bodied men. “If you aren't that, you should hate yourself,” is what the world says.

I, I'm a selfish artist. I want my, my sitters tell my story before me, cause I don't wanna be like talking about myself. Although I am a bit with this project. But Rahliek really did a great job with that: we love ourselves and that's what people fear. If there was one sentence from this project that I want to stand out, it's really that.

I'll just give you a little background about Rahliek. This was in Virginia at this wonderful, amazing, center, Diversity Richmond. It's a huge building. It's - We were, they let us photograph in the gallery. They have a gallery cause it was so hot outside. He's one of a handful of young trans people that had been kicked out by his family, by his family of origin, and adopted by this wonderful family you can see; on the right, that's his girlfriend, and then two of his parents, and then two of his younger siblings.

He talked about when he first met his family - I don't know how they connected - He would like sit on the couch and just like watch TV with his little siblings, those little girls. And one day, one of the girls was like, “Will you be my brother?” And he was like, “Yeah.” Such a beautiful person.

What I talk to people about when I see this portrait, there's a theme of trans anger and how appropriate that is. It's appropriate as a marginalized group under attack, literally under attack, especially when you have layers of marginalization, to be angry at your oppressors and to still have strength and perseverance and love yourself. Do you hear kids talk about anger or is it something they're afraid to talk about?

[00:42:38] Rebecca Minor: Oh, absolutely. I mean, and sometimes it takes a little extra invitation, but for the most part, no, they're full of anger. And sometimes that anger comes out in sadness, right? We know anger is technically a secondary emotion - sorry, therapy [both laugh] -but yes, they're angry, and they have every right to be. Like, this is not fair, and it's not okay. They shouldn't have to worry about these things.

I say this all the time, I feel like, but like just being a teenager is hard enough. But being a teenager, who's also trans, or who's also black; like trying to, for - like to move through the world, this is not a simple task. And to be 20 years old and have already been kicked out by your family of origin, I mean, it's beautiful and amazing that he's found a family who supports him, I'm thrilled.

But we also know for every Rahliek there are countless kids who don't have this new support system. And those are the kids that I really worry about. Right? I worry about my clients, and yet they have parents who found me and they get to see - come to my, you know, meet with me. They have support at school, they have support in lots of places. But there are tons of kids, especially in more rural locations, who don't have access to these kinds of supports.

Jesse Freidin: Yeah.

Rebecca Minor: And that's why, again, I'm so glad that you're telling this story.

[00:44:07] Jesse Freidin: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I work hard to balance going to Chicago or Boston and then Laramie, and then smaller cities. Even though I, I won't always get as many families to show up. That's fine. I went to Chattanooga, that was one of the first trips I ever went to. I want to sort of balance these accounts of families and kids that have Diversity Richmond as a resource, with the kids in Chattanooga who live in fear.

And that being said, I truly believe, and I talk to the families about this a lot, , and I tell 'em to go to my website, there is a resources page on the website. , I truly believe in using, you know, virtual support groups.

Rebecca Minor: Absolutely.

Jesse Freidin: I'm not a therapist, so I, I cannot give therapy advice. But, about a year ago I started a online, just multi-generational, community for twice a month. It's so radical for younger trans people to talk to older trans people. I also volunteer, give my time, as a mentor online for two other groups. And again, it's all virtual, it's all free. Some of these kids are - don't have any community where they are, some kids have a lot. But I think that's one thing that I can also recommend for families is find ways either to get your kid around other trans people of their age and older, whether that's in person, on top of being in therapy, on top of working with your providers, or find a mentor.

[00:45:45] Rebecca Minor: Absolutely. And I, I just wanna loop back to earlier you mentioned that sometimes the parents even look at you like, oh my goodness, I've never met a trans adult who seems, like, happy and healthy and has a job and all the things that they worry won't happen for their kid. That's another reason why we need more visibility and more of these like communities; like the space that you've created, where younger trans guys can talk to you and be like, “Oh wow, someone actually made it to 41. And that doesn't have to feel impossible to me anymore.” Right? Like I have a possibility model of what that could look like.

And that is so important and it's, it's important for young people and it's also really important for the parents, who I think have a lot of fear and haven't been exposed to some of these possibilities. Right? Their narratives are from the seventies, eighties, nineties, and they're not good ones. Sometimes their fear gets in the way of them being able to fully show up for their kid because they don't know what's possible.

[00:46:48] Jesse Freidin: I think that's such a good point. How can we have the parents and some adult trans people just talk to each other? I think that would be interesting. I don’t know how to make that happen - but I will say for this project, yes, I, I could tell that a lot of the parents - could see them - really wanting to imagine their kid becoming an adult. For half of my trips, I had a trans assistant with me. So they saw, you know, two of us having a passion, having careers, being professional, as much as we can be.

And at the same time, you know, I try to make it very clear: I am getting as much as I'm giving. You know, I didn't have parents, who would've shown up for this kind of a project. It's very healing and affirming for me to be doing this exposure therapy for myself. So, again, I keep up with so many of the kids and the families from this project and we've made our own little community and that's really just something I didn't know was gonna happen.

But speaking of, you know, role models and life expectancy and all that kinda stuff; this is Simon who I photographed in Iowa. Again, there's trans people in Iowa. You might not think they're everywhere, but they are. This is another kid who was rejected by his family, had been adopted by this amazing, awesome family.

The dad was one of very few dads who just wouldn't talk to me. He was very, you could tell he loved his kids, but he just didn't wanna talk to me, and that's his prerogative. And then the son, you know, like he was wearing a kind of gay supportive t-shirt. Just really sweet. What Simon was saying in his interview was, he's 18, somebody he’s just about to graduate high school. He was talking a lot [coughs] excuse me, about being an elder, being a trans elder at age 18. And for me that just, really hit me hard, you know-

[00:48:49] Rebecca Minor: how could it not?

Jesse Freidin: Mm-hmm.

Rebecca Minor: I mean, you and I have talked about like what, how do we define what a trans elder is? The fact that that you have identified as one at 41 is also disheartening to me, right? Like I want our trans elders to be elderly [laughs] and I hope that that is where we're heading.

[00:49:15] Jesse Freidin: Mm-hmm. , my hope with these stories is that people can be educated about the heavy, dark realities of the community through these compelling stories. I have lost far too many friends that never made it past 25. You know? There are trans kids that are taking their lives at age eight and 10 etc. at age 18. 18 is not enough of a life.

Through this, you know, wonderful, beautiful person in a story, people can understand really, how dire the risk is. I really am hoping that this is a visual remedy to yes, acknowledge the heavy things, the topics that I'm sure you talked to your clients about, the things that I talked to my mentees about, and people in the community and friends with this powerful, affirming love.

You know, again, Simon was kicked out of his family. I didn't get the whole story, you know, I, again, I asked the same set of questions. If they wanna expand on things they can, but I never push kids to tell me anything. We don't owe our stories to anybody, even people in the community. This mom, like a lot of the other moms, was just saying, you just love your kid. Like, Simon is so smart, he's got a beautiful future in front, in front of him. But because he is a trans person and because he's public about being a trans person -

Rebecca Minor: Mm-hmm.

Jesse Freidin: Who knows what's ahead of him? [pause] Great things, obviously.

[00:50:54] Rebecca Minor: Yeah. I just want to add that whenever I end up in conversations about the frequency of trans youth suicide, I also like to remind people that that number dramatically reduces when we have family support, community support, or even the support of one single person, that number drops by - to 40%.

So it's, it can be so disheartening to hear some of the statistics and read some of the numbers and feel like there's nothing I can do. And yet, you can be one person who can show up and show support. And so I just want to reiterate that too, that like, yes, there is a lot that is still very scary about all of this and we have to acknowledge that and I also want us to hold - right, there's that both, and again of like, both of these things can be true.

[00:51:51] Jesse Freidin: Yeah. I appreciate you putting your professional perspective on that. The only way to have a trans kid is to support them; even if it's just one parent. There's been lots of kids that I've photographed whose parents were separated.

Rebecca Minor: Mm-hmm.

Jesse Freidin: One parent was supportive, one parent wasn't, and those kids were doing great because their parent, they had at least one parent that had their back, and they were - that's all, that's all you need. It can be a teacher, it can be a coach, it can be a - someone, some other person. It can be someone kids connects with as an online support group. Trans kids, trans young people, and trans adults just need to know that they are loved and that they have normal lives.

This flows well into this portrait. This is Sunny, one of the first portraits I did in Texas. There's so many things I love about this.

[00:52:47] Rebecca Minor: I love Sunny. [both laugh]

[00:52:50] Jesse Freidin: She is adorable. She's probably yeah 10 or something now, I keep up with, with her mom a little bit, and she's doing roller derby now. She's just like kicking ass, doing roller derby. Just having -

[00:53:04] Rebecca Minor: I love it. And they came through with the matching t-shirts too, they were like, “We are not messing around.” Yep.

[00:53:09] Jesse Freidin: The, the mom made those t-shirts, the Texas state with the trans flag, and they showed up. This was in the parking lot in Texas, sort of next to a queer-affirming center. But some of these queer centers, because of the fear of backlash or liabilities, they're like, “We'll let you use our parking lot, but we can't talk to you.” And I respected that and that was still very generous.

So they showed up in the parking lot and they're like, “We have to do an outfit change.” And I was like, “Oh, no. What is it gonna be?” But - so they put on these t-shirts - and what you don't see is the mom, she had rainbow stripes in her hair, like very well done rainbow hairdo, and the husband did it.

Rebecca Minor: What?!

Jesse Freidin: And the husband spoke in his interview, which is also on the website, about, you know, he is a Texas-raised, born and bred kind of macho Texan man. And that in the beginning he had a hard time accepting Sunny. And he got a lot of backlash from like his boss, from other men. And he just clearly loves his kid. He was. He was crying when he was talking to me.

Rebecca Minor: Mm-hmm.

Jesse Freidin: And [laughs] you know, it's just a really beautiful example of some - it, it's not easy for, I think I - it's taken me many years to understand this, but I'm not a parent - but I can imagine as a parent, it's difficult when you see your child go through anything that is challenging, that may provide challenges in the future.

But this family loved each other. They were awesome. And again, you support your kid and they can have a normal life. They can just go play roller derby and be normal. And I love that. Yeah, and she's just so cute.

[00:55:09] Rebecca Minor: It's fantastic. A lot of assumptions that get made about dads, I think probably about, about all parents, but I want to give a brief shout out to dads. Who, many of whom, who I've worked with, start off a little bit challenged by some of these concepts. And not all, I want to be clear - who, you know, come from particular backgrounds where they were really raised with very strong narratives around, and cultural expectations around, gender.

So there's a lot of unlearning that has to be done, but at the end of the day, they love their kids and are willing to put in the work and that - I, I would love a space where they can be in conversation with one another. I feel like so often it's, it's pretty isolating, when you're like, feel like some of the only families in the community, or certainly the only guy at your job, depending on what kind of work you do, who has this going on. And, and so often that's not true, but it feels that way.

I mean, I love moms too. We love moms. All the moms are so powerful in this project and it's so evident in the way that so often they have their hands resting on the kid's shoulder in this like “I have got you.” Right. And we heard that in Cam's mom at the beginning, of just like, I would go anywhere for you. And there's no doubt about that.

But these are challenges that parents often don't anticipate. Right. And I say that to parents all when they're like embarrassed cause they're like, “I'm, I'm cool, I'm liberal, I should be totally comfortable with this.” And it's like, yes. And this was not in the books you read when you conceived and were kind of anticipating what your kid's life was gonna look like. Things change.

I just love seeing this. And this is another great one where both parents are like clearly, you know, just their body language reads so clearly to me in this image.

[00:57:06] Jesse Freidin: Yeah, I, I love - I, I've been a portrait photographer for so long - and I love being a voyeur and just seeing intimacy and embodied language and just small, subtle, subtle things.

But I'll also just do a shout out to dads.[Rebecca laughs] Obviously so many moms have been incredible and so, so kind to me in this project, immensely kind. And I'll also say there have been so many dads, this, this family included, who have really been very emotional, and just said, “Just love your kid.” I mean, I think that's the message that I heard from so many fathers.

This was a family, in the south, a family of faith, and talked a little bit about some bumps in the road in the beginning with their faith, but how you just love your kid.

One of the portraits that I, I'm not showing in this presentation, cause I try and change it up a little bit each time of a family I photographed in New Hampshire, that father said, “Just love your kid.” Another family in Texas that father said, “Just love your kid.” It's, you know, sometimes dads don't mince words and I appreciate that.

Rebecca Minor: Yes. [both laugh]

Jesse Freidin: So, and what I love about this, again, this Callum - such a incredibly smart and well-spoken young man, just such a beautiful presence. He emailed me and then his dad emailed me. They both emailed me after the session to say thank you, which I, I truly appreciate. You know, I, I am an artist and I need positive feedback and that's just how we are.

So, but yeah, Callum said that after our interview in portrait, that, you know, he had been struggling with wanting to be more public with his, you know, connect to his friends more, do more activism. And that kind of doing this process with me encouraged him to do that and showed him that he could. And he thanked me for that. And I thought that was so powerful. And then his dad emailed me and, you know, thanked me for that too, and said that this process of letting himself be seen, I think, helped really raise his confidence. And I, I, there's nothing more affirming than that, I think for me, you know, to hear himself.

[00:59:33] Rebecca Minor: Oh, absolutely. Right. The fact that, you know, he feels like he can stand up and be himself is huge. And I'm glad you talked with families who are, religious. Because I think that's another theme that tends to come up with families that I work with and certainly families in the South. I tend to see it more that, it can be a bumpy road at first, in part, because of the messaging that people may have received, or not being sure if their church will be supportive. or whatever faith space they're a part of. Yet so many of these places, you know, if you read signs around different churches, they say like, “All are welcome,” or, you know, “Everybody looks the same on Sunday.”

And it's like, well, what does that actually look like in practice? And so I'm, I'm just so pleased that, that families are still able to maintain their faith and find supportive faith space communities and also show up for their kid.

[01:00:30] Jesse Freidin: I'll show this really quickly. I just love this portrait. I, I did photograph dogs for 15 years professionally, so I think maybe some families - I wanted them to Google me. I hope, I think, most families did Google me and make sure that I was a legit person, as I was, was very appropriate. A handful of families brought their dogs. And I just, I again, I love just the peacefulness and self-knowledge and the closeness of the family.

[begin recorded interview audio with Lexi, Lexi’s mom, and Jesse]

[01:00:59] Lexi: It's really terrifying because it feels like we're moving backwards sometimes. It's scary that now there's laws actually in place that make it harder and harder for us to live.

Lexi’s mom: Looking back, I can understand how some parents may be hesitant for their kids to be educated. I know that she still feels the same way today. Would've been helpful for her to be exposed to different genders so that she could feel more connected. She's been a little girl ever since I can remember, but it was not as open as it is today.

Lexi: I think the laws are sort of just making me a little scared for the future. It's already hard enough, but it's about to become harder.

[01:01:52] Lexi’s mom: I want parents to be more informed one way or the other so they can make decisions to help their children. That's what I've seen, like she's so happy. But this is the best life that we can give her.

[01:02:05] Lexi: These laws aren't okay, and I think that they need faces to see that we don't agree, and we're here, and we don't like being put down. I wanna say believe in yourself. You'll make it. You'll get there, you'll get to where you're going, and you'll find happiness. You'll find people who support you and love you unconditionally, and you're gonna have a great life; just keep being you.”

[end pre-recorded interview audio]

[01:02:42] Jesse Freidin: Anyways, Lexi, one of my favorite portraits. Another example of a, a dad who was not supportive in the beginning and a family that had resources and lived in a, a big city, and struggled to really find medical support. Another family that, you know, really had never met trans adults, you know, and just such a wonderful kid. I love Lexi's message. Again, I, - that was her response to, “What do you wanna say to the next trans person in line?”

And so I'll just go from that - this audio to the last portrait that I always like to end on. So, again, we've spoken about some really hard topics. As Rebecca says, you know, we balance - this is a balancing act, accepting the reality of what is happening, in terms of the attacks in our community, the attacks in our providers, the difficulties trans young people have at school; things are heavy right now. And we have community, like we have today, and we have families that are supporting their kids.

So this is Caroline, the mom. She's wonderful. Her kid Nova had signed up for a session. This was in Florida. Again, things are real bad down there right now, really bad. I don't know if any of these families are still there. But her daughter had signed up for a session, but had been in and out of the hospital for suicidal ideation. And a couple days before our session, she went back to the hospital; so she was safe. And her mom asked her, you know, “Do you still want me to do this portrait?”

Some kids don't make it. Some kids, thankfully, get to the hospital when they can be safe; so many things can happen. And I had invited a few parents who had lost their kids to come and, you know, no one had taken me up, and understandably. Caroline was just, she's just amazing. You know, very long interview. She asked her daughter if she could come without her, and that's what this portrait is.

I, I think Nova is, is still struggling, but she's okay and that's what's important. Because she has a mom that unconditionally, unapologetically, has her back and that's why she is alive. But I just think this is an important message to balance the joy and the power of like Lexi's story and Rahliek's story and Steve's story and, and all the joy and power and resilience, with what is at stake. So that is a last portrait. Rebecca, do you have any final thoughts?

[01:05:36] Rebecca Minor: I think you just summed that up so beautifully and really I'm relieved to hear that Nova was in the hospital. I wasn't sure where this story was going. But just the, the image of the empty chair after seeing so many is incredibly powerful. And I think about parents like this who also could have stayed home, right? She could have canceled, she could have said, my kid's in the hospital and I'm going to take the day for myself, or whatever, anything, and instead she got consent from her kid and showed up.

And that to me is, is at the end of the day what, what we want from parents is this, like, “I don't always get it and I don't always have to, but I can show up.”

[01:06:28] Jesse Freidin: Right, right, I, yeah, exactly. I - for me, I feel the love for her kid here in just her posture. And I always had the portraits before the interview, so, you know, I, I learned much more about her after this portrait, but -

Rebecca Minor: Oh, interesting. Okay. Yeah.

Jesse Freidin: Yeah. This project would not be possible without so many families responding to me, trusting me, trusting their kids, be, again, willing to put themselves and their identities on the line to help not only their kid, but other kids. So, it's such an incredible honor to do this work, and I am honored to just show up with the camera and microphone.

And I am excited to keep doing it. I don't want this project just to be a book and go on the shelf. And I don't want this just to show at a gallery that no one can get to. And I am talking to lots of universities, I'm talking to lots of queer centers, lots of family organizations that will host an exhibit in 2024. I will self-publish this, so I have extreme control over, over how this book is done and how the stories are told. And so I do not have to compromise anything to make a publisher happy. I want this to be accessible.

And so I am also doing a lot of virtual presentations with colleges, and conferences, and hospitals, and companies. So if anyone is interested in, in bringing me on to bring this programming in, or have Rebecca bring her programming in, we are available.

So here is a slide of resources that I forgot that I had. Areyouokayportraits.com is the website. You can look at a, a bunch of images and stories, not all of them obviously. If you'd like to get involved and sit for a portrait interview, you can email me and you can get in touch with me that way.

And then, as I mentioned, on the bottom here are three groups that I think are really wonderful for online mentoring. Samdevorah.org is, again, it's free, you can sign your kid up and they can get paired with, an older, trans person. Same with Trans Family SOS, they're based out of San Diego. Both groups will try to match interests and, you know, etc. And then This Trans Collective, that's the group that I've started, with a friend of mine. It's 18 + only because, again, we're not therapists, but it's a really wonderful group.

[01:09:07] Rebecca Minor: I'm just gonna plug for you, because you skipped over it, that part of the purpose of today was to help fund this series via donation. You just jumped right past that bullet point, so I wanna come back in. I think as an artist, I'm sure it's hard to, to ask for this yourself. As you all heard, Jesse's doing all of this from the outreach, to the travel, to like - and none of this can happen if there's no funding. If you want to find a way to help tell these stories and you aren't behind the camera, or you don't have a young trans person who you're supporting, another way that you can do that is by making a donation.

[01:09:47] Jesse Freidin: I appreciate that. Thank you. , I didn't mean to skip over that, but it - yes, this is true. For many years of my career, I made a lot of good money selling photos to people and that was wonderful. And this is not a for-profit project; I've gotten donations for $5 and that will get me a coffee on the road. I've had donations of a couple thousand dollars and that really lets me book hotels. I, I have to be safe on the road. It is an incredible amount of mileage and hard work. And so, I will say I have, I think, raised like over $15,000 just through my website, not through a Kickstarter or anything. And it's really, means so much that -

Rebecca Minor: That's amazing.

Jesse Freidin: That fuels this project.

[01:10:32] Chris Angel Murphy: First off, I just want to thank both of you for being here and doing this today. Jesse, this is an amazing project. I am so proud of you and I'm so happy that so many stories are being told. And Rebecca, you already know that I love you. Rebecca is a gender specialist. And so in the last couple of minutes I just did want to help plug some of her resources that she has. So Rebecca, if you could tell us a little bit more about your coaching, your parent coaching.

[01:11:03] Rebecca Minor: Sure. So I designed the parent coaching resource in part because I can only see so many kids in therapy in a week, and I found that parents were really needing some support. And while there are a plethora of wonderful opportunities like PFLAG to go to groups, some parents aren't in a place where they are either ready to be in a group or they don't want to be, or they feel like they need more individualized support.

Ultimately, it's supposed to be an opportunity for parents to ask the questions they might be embarrassed to ask elsewhere, ashamed to ask, not sure even what they need to be asking, and kind of to have a guide through this process when they have no idea what to expect. Now, having done this with countless families, I can sometimes kind of anticipate some of the bumps in the road before they even happen, so that we can be proactive and take care of things in advance.

I'm so grateful for the families that I get to work with. So, don't hesitate to reach out.

[01:12:08] Chris Angel Murphy: And if you are not sure how to talk about gender with kids, if you are a parent, if you're a caregiver, if you're a teacher - Rebecca, you can do this more justice than I can - you can go ahead and scan the QR code and it'll take you directly to the course. But yeah, what do you wanna say about this course that you've created, Rebecca?

[01:12:27] Rebecca Minor: I created this course because so often par - I found that adults, some parents, teachers, whomever, are afraid to have conversations in part because they don't have the language to do so. And so while they know how to talk to their kids, obviously, and they, they might not know that much about gender, or might not have been invited to spaces where they can learn this new vocabulary, have an understanding of how gender develops in childhood, and then actually have some tangible tools to utilize. I made the course to be self-led. It can be on your own time. You can just watch it or engage as much as or as little as you want. There's tons of reflection prompts. Ultimately, it's for having the conversations that matter.

[01:13:13] Chris Angel Murphy: Awesome. Well, we are at time, so any last words, Jesse, and then I'll throw it to Rebecca.

[01:13:21] Jesse Freidin: Well, I just want to say thanks for everyone to that, that showed up and appreciate everyone's interest in this project and, and hopefully that this has helped you have a sense of how to support trans kids in your life, whether they're your kids or people in your community. And I appreciate Chris Angel and Rebecca, you guys, holding the space and having this conversation with me.

Chris Angel Murphy: Yeah.

[01:13:40] Rebecca Minor: Yeah. Thank you so much. I, I don't have much more to add besides this is just a wonderful opportunity. It's so great to see different folks, you know, little comments pop up here and there. Really appreciate the support, just honored to get to be a part of presenting what I believe is such, such important work that could really connect people to the meaning behind all of this and how we can really show up for these kids. So thank you so much.

[01:14:10] Chris Angel Murphy: Yeah. And so with that said again, please support Jesse's project. There are still opportunities to book a portrait or a session. Again, Rebecca has really great resources. Rather than putting anything on your own children, please go to Rebecca instead so that she can support you with the coaching, or again, you can learn through an online self-paced course.

Other than that, just wanna say thank you again, all of you, so much for attending. Just cannot thank all of you enough for showing up today and for all of your patience with the tech hiccups cause it happens, you know? Thank you all so much. Take care and have a great rest of your weekend. Bye, everyone.

Jesse Freidin: Thanks, everyone.